SmallTalk "Rules"
Lars-Erik_Olson said on August 31, 2006 22:42:
Please feel free to offer suggestions below, as this set of rules is STILL IN "DRAFT" MODE. We'd like to come to a mutual agreement as to what the rules should be.
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Dear TDR subscriber and SmallTalk participant: We have an appreciation for all of our readers. There are those who seem to always see everything through rose-colored glasses, and those who almost always seem to have only something negative to say. It's all good, in our opinion, as long as the few rules we have are maintained (I'll come back and update/expand upon this):
1. Participation in our SmallTalk discussion area is limited to TDR subscribers who have provided accurate information when subscribing to this web-based newspaper. We do not charge a subscription fee… and we invest an enormous amount of time in providing you with news, features, periodic contests and this discussion area. One of the LEAST things you can do in return, is to not disrespect this effort by providing fake, inaccurate, or misleading information when you subscribe (especially since you can opt-out of having this info displayed to other readers). Please go to the "Change My Setting" link to update your information and keep it current, as email addresses sometimes change.
2. No personal attacks (i.e., no flaming). Posts that contain some kind of direct insult to another discussion participant will be deleted. While you are, of course, free to disagree with what someone else says, even to go as far as to say "I think your comment is rather stupid," it's NOT OK to write "I think you're stupid." We trust our readers will understand the difference, and keep far away from that line that should not be crossed.
3. No vulgar language (no matter how those words might be spelled or abbreviated). In particular, we disapprove of words that might still sound vulgar to some readers (myself included actually, even if I hear one word in particular quite often, unfortunately, while riding the NYC subway) and you may also no longer think of it as being particularly vulgar. We ask you to please be ladies and gentlemen.
4. No blind SmallTalk thread topics. A reader should not have to guess as to what the topic is about; should not have to "click in" in order to discover that. For example, "Guess what?" would AT LEAST need to be "Guess what song I just heard on the radio?." Since that still involves a bit of guessing, "Just heard 'One Wish' on WPLJ New York" would be better yet.
5. Please avoid starting a NEW discussion topic, if a previously created topic on this same subject already exists (within recent memory).
6. Only reply if you have something to add to the discussion! Some SmallTalk participants seem to think they have to reply to every single thread, no matter if they have something of value to add to the discussion or not. If you don't know the answer to a question, please don't bother replying with things like "I can't help you" or "I don't know"? Such an answer doesn't help anyone serves only to interfere with someone trying to read quickly through the responses. Similarly, we discourage posts where you have nothing much more to say than "I agree" or "Me too."
7. The Daily Roxette does not allow links to direct downloads, nor the use of TDR for "sharing" songs. [as pointed out in comments below… this rule needs further clarification]
8. If you have something to say, don't repeat words thinking it has more impact. Example: Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, YES!!!!!!!! It's just a waste of space. Is the same point not conveyed in THIS example: Yes, yes, YES!!! Therefore, no more than three (3) repetitive words OR punctuation marks!!! (one, two, THREE exclamation points… and I've reached the limit)
9. We do not allow comments, or any portion of a comment, to be in any language other than English. There are some exceptions to this rule: a) This rule does not apply in the International discussions section. b) A short sentence or two is allowed, as long as a translation into English is included in parenthesis: Förstår du? (Do you understand?) c) The only other exception we can think of… would be in an article or thread that was set up (by TDR) for use in an "Ask Per" scenario. Questions posed in Swedish would not be deleted in this particular case.
10. No one may join a discussion topic simply to sabotage it, or in an obvious attempt to "bait" others into responding to him/her in a negative way. Some needy people crave attention so much, that they get some kind of perverse "kick" out of stirring things up… just so they can come back and see the mess they created. This will not be tolerated here.
11. There will be no hijacking of discussion threads. Stick to the original topic. Consider starting a new discussion topic, rather than make the current one into a discussion about something that was not originally intended.
12. Contrary to popular belief (or so it seems sometimes) this is NOT a completely open "forum." How many times have we read some ill-informed subscriber state "I have the right to my opinion. I have the right to say anything I want to here, you can't tell me to shut up" or something quite similar to that. First of all, no reader should ever tell another reader to "shut up" (see Rule #2). But we've said many times, in many places, that TDR reserves the right, like any other publication (especially a news-oriented publication), to edit (for brevity, clarity or violation of a set rule) or to completely unpublish any comment. Just because we currently give you the privilege of self-posting without prior review by a moderator, that doesn't mean you have the right to "free speech" here, as the concept of free speech only applies in a public forum (a public park for example), and this is a privately-held publication. If you want to exercise that particular right on the Internet, start your own website or blog.
13. TDR does not wish to publish comments that appear to be racist, homophobic, or non-tolerant of any other group of people.
14. Just like everywhere else on SmallTalk, the subject of new discussion topic in the MarketPlace section must clearly and simply indicate what is for sale, and not contain "promotional fluff." "Look at this GREAT eBay item!!" for example would NOT be allowed, whereas "eBay auction: Roxette Times Square t-shirt" would be. We would also ask that some self-constraint be shown… and that the privilige of posting here not be abused by a seller coming back to "bump" his/her post back up to the top (or having a friend post to the thread for this purpose).
15. Finally, allow us to encourage you to BE NICE to each other. We're all brothers and sisters here in the usually happy, sometimes slightly disfunctional family that someone many, many years ago called "Roxers." [does anyone remember who coined this term?] Please have respect for others, and try — as best as you can — to think through what you have to say here BEFORE YOU POST IT, as much as we take the time to write, edit, and re-edit what we publish ourselves.
RELATED THOUGHTS: We worked very hard over the years to establish The Daily Roxette as the premiere source of credible information about all things Roxette-related. Ever since Visa Kopu, our Publisher and Editor-in-Chief, first established this website, he had the idea to do so using a newspaper model. Not only have we been fortunate enough to gain the respect of fans… and enjoy very robust, sometimes amazing circulation figures (that would be "number of hits" for those of you not quite in the newspaper mindset), but we've been honored to be recognized as equally entitled to be part of the "press" or "media" by Roxette's management, record label, and for that matter, Per and Marie themselves. While we often cite other publications, we have to admit we're thrilled when some other newspaper picks up on one of OUR stories, and cites "The Daily Roxette" as their source. Most of our readers would probably be shocked to learn how much time has gone into all of this…. how much time it takes just to write, edit and publish ONE news article. All of us on staff are unpaid. TDR does not charge a mandatory subsciption fee (although we do solicit voluntary contibutions). All we ask of our subscribers, is to understand what this newpaper is all about, and to honor our work here by not making it more difficult for us. We consider it a HUGE waste of our time to have to go in and edit out something that the writer should never have included in the first place. We'd much rather spend what time we have available to devote to TDR in providing content.
GT_85 said on September 1, 2006 21:42:
I also think there shouldn’t be any messages that not even tries to be constructive, like “i agree” and “LOL” or “:)”.
LittleSpooky said on September 2, 2006 00:02:
Awwww... crap!
And I just bought a new flame thrower too!
*walks off, kicking a rock and pouting*
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I have a request actually:
No hijacking of threads. If it doesn’t really pertain to what the topic is, don’t post in it. I know mine has been hijacked all to crap, and I was hoping to make some folks stop and think. It worked for a few hours, then went down the pisser.
RJ1976 said on September 3, 2006 13:25:
LittleSpooke—-> You’re are funny...
Oh.... so you bought my flamethrouer on eBay :)
Starrox said on September 4, 2006 08:50:
There’s another rule you need - only reply if you have something to add to the discussion! Some people seem to think they have to reply to every single thread, no matter if they have something to add or not! If you don’t know the answer to a question, why bother replying with things like “I can’t help you” or “I don’t know”? Such an answer doesn’t help anyone and certainly not the person asking a question...
Lars-Erik_Olson (moderator) said on September 8, 2006 13:52:
Thanks StarRox, we agree and added it.
thenicekai said on September 8, 2006 14:14:
I would delete this porn site example. It doesn’t fit the style of these rules.
Fine to have these rules (bad that they are even neccessary...). But now they will have to be placed where people HAVE to see them.
LittleSpooky said on September 8, 2006 14:57:
LEO: Well written. I just saved the list to my HD for future reference :o)
Lars-Erik_Olson (moderator) said on September 8, 2006 17:17:
NiceKai... (btw. is the other Kai the “not nice” one?)
That wasn’t supposed to appear in the final version, it was just my weird sense of humor at the time. I forgot to delete it.
Little Spooky... this is still a work in progress... we’re still VERY open to constructive suggestions).
Judith (moderator) said on September 8, 2006 18:44:
LS, I used it on Dahlgren-attling.net and adapted it for TDR as far as I remember.. LONG ago ;) I actually thought it was posted on Small Talk already months ago :S
BUT
I made it mixing example rule texts from some websites.. (don’t ask me from where anymore..) :P
nate said on September 9, 2006 11:25:
No hijacking threads, is this a new rule or an existing one?
Lars-Erik_Olson (moderator) said on September 9, 2006 21:08:
Nate: We’re trying to come to a common consensus as to what the rules should be. This was added due to a suggestion above by LittleSpooky. We’re aware that there’s been a lack of cooperation from certain readers in regards to following the “rules,” but we’re also aware that they haven’t been readily available to read (even internally amongst our staff). Thus, enforcement of the rules has been somewhat uneven. The editors and moderators of this newspaper REALLY don’t want to spend any more time than is absolutely necessary “enforcing” rules. We fully expect our subscribers, in return for the ability to self-post without prior approval, to follow the entire set of rules voluntarily. It’s in all of our best interests then, to make sure everyone knows exactly what they are.
Please feel free to suggest edits or additions to what you already see in the first post above. – LEO
LittleSpooky said on September 10, 2006 01:50:
Jude: Ya gots me on that one. Never been there :) Never heard of it until I read your post :) Uhm... anything else? :D
Nate: I’d suggested the hijacking of the threads thing because on several other forums I use (couple of private ones), it’s a rule there and it helps sometimes. Example:
Topic is about the latest movie you’d seen. Suddenly, 9 posts down, someone’s talking exclusively about the weather. Now I’m cool with someone saying: “I remember when I saw that movie with my bf / gf, it was raining like cats and dogs that night and we’d decided to catch a movie before taking the bus home....” and then give a review of the movie.
But not to start the topic and have it turn into the weather or whether or not you heard Song X at your local apothecary / drug store. Ya dig?
thenicekai said on September 11, 2006 10:44:
As people keep spreading the newest Roxette songs here again... what is actually the TDR rule concerning those downloads?
ally77 said on September 11, 2006 13:08:
I really think there is little they can do... if someone put a link up where you could download the songs... they would remove it!
In this day and age with the internet, it’s bound to happen....
I am still surprised at who it was who leaked them!
Judith (moderator) said on September 11, 2006 18:15:
of course we don’t allow links to direct downloads, neither the use of TDR for sharing songs, this is why all topics that are inviting to sharing illegal files are now closed (couldn’t do it ealier, unfortunately).
denny said on September 11, 2006 18:30:
I’m confused now.... There are tons of topics and posts with various songs, demos, concerts, remixes.... which people shared. And they weren’t archived. Does this ’no illegal stuff for share’ apply only for new songs or only for regular songs (not demos etc)? Actually Myth is a demo too, right? Hm... Totaly confused. I would like to know for any future references. Please explain. Thanks.
thenicekai said on September 11, 2006 18:52:
Thank you Judith, I somehow knew that this rule exists. Of course it is impossible to watch the forum every minute. And as we can see people don’t care about exactly this one rule at all and react pissed when you tell them not to do that.
The usual answer you get is: Per is rich or I would buy the CD anyway, later, one day, maybe....never.
Maybe people don’t understand that what they have done today is anything but good for the connection between TDR and Per&Marie. If the leakers remain so aggressive (yes, I mean this word), they soon will not get anything more to leak. No news, no games, maybe not even music any longer. Cos Per may be pissed now too, and it is his very good right to be so.
Good that TDR has closed the gates now.
edit: typos
marcusvandeursen said on September 11, 2006 21:51:
@nicekai; am personally thrilled to have heard the new songs but indeed a much better idea to close off all such topics... especially as the songs would also get spread among non-regular visitors otherwise and nobody would buy the single anymore.
marcusvandeursen said on September 11, 2006 22:23:
@ally; re. ’Released stuff I think they allow to share.... but stuff that is not officially released is not allowed... as it is illegal! ... however all it take is one person and it starts’
Would self say released stuff is worse to have online than officially unreleased stuff... don’t think Per minds his demos being share, which he does himself even through bad hair day, as he considers them not good enough for release on an official record. It’s much worse if officially released tracks are being shared; for those people should be told to buy the records in order to get them.
Re. the tunes that came along this afternoon, would have been just as happy and would perhaps even have preferred to see 30-sec. snippet of only the new songs just as a preview (like it was presented in the old days on e.g. hand.nu). Compare it to iTunes; any songs available on the ITMS has a 30-sec snippet that one can listen to. Those people who want to hear more are after hearing something they like only triggered extra to buy the songs.
thenicekai said on September 11, 2006 22:26:
@ally77: Don’t say it is impossible to avoid such scenarios. Start with yourself. Why did you actively share the songs?
Now you might say: If you didn’t do it, someone else had taken your place.
False.
With your action you encouraged more people to ask for and share the songs. Nobody seemed to feel guilty. It is hard enough to fight the sharers, there is no need to make this fight even more difficult.
It does not matter when a song is leaked. It does a matter that a song is leaked.
If you should ever meet Roxette in the future, can you still look them straight in the eyes without blushing?
Room_service said on September 12, 2006 05:34:
thenicekai, I’d like to know if you already got the songs. I am 100% sure you have them and you have played them a million times. Of course, you will deny that, but it’s not much plausible you don’t have them by now. A bit out of curiosity, another bit ’cause you are a fan and can’t resist the idea of playing the songs. Be sincere. Maybe you care about your “reputation” of a clean moderator (in SOAP site, not here). And that’s the reason you are throwing this moral speech to us.
But don’t overreact, please. Don’t make a drama out of this. If I have a way to search in you HD, to see if you don’t have the songs, then I will trust in you. But as I can’t, let me be a bit sceptical!
Judith (moderator) said on September 12, 2006 06:02:
R_S: let’s please not turn this into a personal discussion. This is about the Small Talk rules, now everybody knows how we go about it, there is nothing more to it. Thanks :)
thenicekai said on September 12, 2006 08:26:
To make the answer short: I’ve had OW for a couple of days but did not talk about it, and especially did I not share it. Of Reveal I heard a snippet. Anyone... I listened to it some weeks ago when I visited someone who had the song. I have no copy of it and never asked for one. Myth have I heard over a phone, I could have asked for a copy but didn’t. Believe it or not (you will argue anyway and I don’t care). It would be very easy for me to get the files from the internet, I still speak quite a good Russian which I learned at school. ;-)
About the soap forum: All the “errors” you thought to have seen happened because I had to clean after you. You couldn’t resist to offer your “services” between the lines again. But since the soap forum is an official one and has therefore sharper rules concerning certain issues, it is necessary to be strict in some points. Sharing copyright protected material is one of them. And somehow I have the feeling that we are a small and happy community over there. We have no fights and whenever someone causes trouble, it’s often enough the “normal” member who tells him how to behave, not me. The reason why you see so few topics is that old topics are automatically deleted after 6 weeks of inactivity. This is to protect the server from burning or so. Yep, it’s weird and I don’t really understand it either. ;-)
What makes me sad though is that you still don’t accept the general rules that exist in order to create a friendly atmosphere among Per&Marie, the TDR staff and the TDR members. You have no idea what consequences the leaking of the songs has on the future of TDR and the soap forum. You (among others) brought us all in trouble but you fail to see it.
@activewatcher: You’re in the wrong topic, maybe? :-) edit: Ah, sorry, you were faster.

whateveriam said on August 31, 2006 22:50:
I realised the other day that this makes no sense due to changes...so I’ve deleted it.
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